I know you as this deep individual and this has fried my mind, momentarily. I would not want to come up against you in a debate ANYTIME at all… Here’s my liver, make mince meat of it for free… In fact, I bow before your superior intelect. Well stated sire, very eloquently put. I agree 100%!!

All the issues raised have been my “gripe” with the system for a long time… unfortunately, as you say, the leaders are to blame, the followers are sheep, ‘blerr-ing’ out responses, and blindly doing what the sheep in front of them does, as if on rote.

I, too now, am going to begin to tackle this point in my own life. My parents have already stated that they are “praying for me..!!” That’s fine. It gives them something to do with their time in the old age home…

Well done again, Deon.

I like this response. I like discussing with people who think through their opinions, as clearly you do. I agree with most of what you’re saying, but would respond with these points:
I don’t think all religious people are weak at all, in fact many of my religious friends are powerful and intelligent people – but I do think that all religious people are gullible, as was I when I adopted those views. Not bad, or wrong, or stupid… just gullible. I think I’ll do an article on this point to flesh it out further.
Any judgement or intolerance I may portray is against the system, not the people. A system is maintained by its leaders. I think that Christian leaders don’t realize how much pain and devastation they have caused in the world. Jesus himself had no problems with temple going Jews, but had a lot to say about their Pharisee leaders.

I’m 100% with your last sentence. The distinction is between religion vs walking a spiritual path. I have no doubt we’ll be chatting some more.

After all, it strikes me as deeply ironic to declare ourselves open-minded, and then ridicule others for thinking differently, when thinking differently means an authentic choice to be religious. And yes, there is such a thing – not all devoutly religious people are by definition “weak and gullible”. To assume this is insulting, arrogant, and smacks of a narcissistic attention seeking. (Taking on religion always gets one some attention).

I think the issue is that one needs to distinguish between simply buying into organized religion and all the emotional manipulation that religious fanatics cling to, and a truly considered, rational choice to follow a spiritual path.

All of this was just a preface to my saying I agree strongly with what you have said; these are VERY similar to my own thoughts that led me to eventually identifying myself as an athiest. (Sorry about only using the initials, but I felt I had to do that, as stupid as that sounds.)

I am wondering, Deon, exactly what made you change your mind? Was it an aha-moment or a longer process? What did you feel, besides the “shame”, when you realized that your life, your whole system is upright down?

The most wonderful thing is that you keep speaking to people on your trainings. You help them as you helped many in your missions, you just do it now without the religious frame. Imagine it this way: You prepared yourself for your real actual mission in the church, because of tradition. What you are doing now is a relatively new issue in history. Good luck! I´m happy to be one of your trainees:)